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Old Forum Index » Baseball League Forums » Speed Leagues » Gaylord Perry League » Milwaukee Tanks, back in action
don4593
It's fine. It's nothing personal. I just hope we can input a rule to take out the incentive for finishing with so many losses
March 09, 2015 at 06:36PM View BBCode
He was my reliever. An injury brought him up. I already went over why he was in my lineup in the first place. Take a look at my roster again. I don't think you understand the definition of tanking and rebuilding. I am in a slow rebuild because the trade market is dry. There is a fine line between rebuilding and tanking. I've been playing this game a while to understand what I am seeing.It's fine. It's nothing personal. I just hope we can input a rule to take out the incentive for finishing with so many losses
ryang
March 09, 2015 at 06:57PM View BBCode
I was the one who offered the suggestion of a loss penalty when I first joined the league, but that seemed to be met with some opposition here. I wouldn't know what else to suggest other than being penalized for not having a red letter player, but my guess is that would be less popular than the loss penalty...
ahmlton
March 09, 2015 at 07:11PM View BBCode
Nothing wrong at all with what ryang doing. If you look at a lot of teams rosters you can come up with questions. I've seen guys with solid A players in the minors!!!! It happens. Worry about your own teams.
Leonard
March 09, 2015 at 07:21PM View BBCode
Not that anybody probably cares, but I left the league because of the tanking. Ryang, if I go back and look at your other teams the pattern was the same, tank, get high picks, win a bunch of games for several seasons, repeat. In my opinion, this is not the way the game should be played. It may result in some titles but it spoils the game for the other owners.
ahmlton
March 09, 2015 at 07:35PM View BBCode
I, like others, admit that my strategy is to dump assets for picks. The only thing to consider is how you can get as good as possible for when you can compete. This isn't real life. There are no fans to consider. It's almost a mathematic thing. How can I be really good? There is no benefit to being middle of the road. To make other owners happy? Not really a concern. I've also been in leagues where there is a loss penalty. I still have same strategy. Actually makes it a little more interesting trying to find the sweet spot. Collusion anf inactivity are the only things we should guard against. I find inactivity FAR more of a problem than tanking.
nuzzy62
I care, sorry to see you go.
March 09, 2015 at 08:08PM View BBCode
Originally posted by Leonard
Not that anybody probably cares, but I left the league because of the tanking. Ryang, if I go back and look at your other teams the pattern was the same, tank, get high picks, win a bunch of games for several seasons, repeat. In my opinion, this is not the way the game should be played. It may result in some titles but it spoils the game for the other owners.
I care, sorry to see you go.
nuzzy62
1) Auto-promote, and should be corrected the next time you are online;
2) Minor League bust - possible major league gem. Since this is a variable development league, if a guy goes 0-18 in the first half of a season, I think it is acceptable to play him in the majors since the only way he will get better is at the major league level. He'll be completely awful, but otherwise you're just throwing away the pick.
March 09, 2015 at 08:12PM View BBCode
The only reasons C players should be in the majors:1) Auto-promote, and should be corrected the next time you are online;
2) Minor League bust - possible major league gem. Since this is a variable development league, if a guy goes 0-18 in the first half of a season, I think it is acceptable to play him in the majors since the only way he will get better is at the major league level. He'll be completely awful, but otherwise you're just throwing away the pick.
don4593
March 09, 2015 at 08:12PM View BBCode
Would anyone be in favor of a lottery type system? I can figure out the details and present some options. I feel like this is in between the most harsh tanking rule and what we have in place now
ryang
I've only had 6 teams in the many years of being on this site. If you had asked me why a one of my EOL teams and the OCL team and even the RRL team in the end won then lost big, you'd be told my teams were left stagnant for months then sold because my wife and I had a kid and I left the site for a year and change.
The second go around in the EOL I never won the championship and spent many seasons rebuilding a rebuild. My team was never THAT good. 8 second place finishes in 45 seasons tells you that much. Plus, the EOL has a loss penalty. Do you think I want to hit that every year?
Why do you think my team is bad now? What can I do to make it better to the point of mediocre? I have no players and nothing to trade. As I mentioned before, when I first joined the league Rich told me to scale back the tanking. I obliged. This time around, I have no good players. The waiver wire doesn't have good players. Would you trade your first and 2nd rounders to be a .500 team if you were in my shoes?
Again, I'm sorry you left. But, don't use me alone as a reason when you never reached out to me and never looked at other teams that are doing more or equal "tanking" than I am.
[Edited on 3-9-2015 by ryang]
March 09, 2015 at 08:17PM View BBCode
Leonard, I'm sorry you left the league. I don't understand why you wouldn't reach out to me to give me a chance to explain how I play the game?I've only had 6 teams in the many years of being on this site. If you had asked me why a one of my EOL teams and the OCL team and even the RRL team in the end won then lost big, you'd be told my teams were left stagnant for months then sold because my wife and I had a kid and I left the site for a year and change.
The second go around in the EOL I never won the championship and spent many seasons rebuilding a rebuild. My team was never THAT good. 8 second place finishes in 45 seasons tells you that much. Plus, the EOL has a loss penalty. Do you think I want to hit that every year?
Why do you think my team is bad now? What can I do to make it better to the point of mediocre? I have no players and nothing to trade. As I mentioned before, when I first joined the league Rich told me to scale back the tanking. I obliged. This time around, I have no good players. The waiver wire doesn't have good players. Would you trade your first and 2nd rounders to be a .500 team if you were in my shoes?
Again, I'm sorry you left. But, don't use me alone as a reason when you never reached out to me and never looked at other teams that are doing more or equal "tanking" than I am.
[Edited on 3-9-2015 by ryang]
ryang
[Edited on 3-9-2015 by ryang]
March 09, 2015 at 10:14PM View BBCode
And taking a look at the owner cards, with my above non active owner years included, 30% of my seasons are 100-loss to your 20%. I know its a 50% spread, but again please take into my account a couple months of inactive ownership and look at the teams I've taken over...they've all be horrid at the time of purchase except my rrl team which was a 1950 one. My sample size is also much smaller which effects % easier.[Edited on 3-9-2015 by ryang]
Leonard
March 10, 2015 at 04:26AM View BBCode
I've taken over many a bad team so I understand what you're talking about. The difference is that I always put the best possible team on the field given the roster I have. You, on the other hand, put the worst team possible on the field in order to get the #1 pick.
ryang
I've been asking for people's suggestions. Do I trade my first rounders to get better players and finish near .400? Or do I play all B+ players from the waiver wire and don't play my 23 year olds? Or do I bring up someone from my minors at OS21? I can replace one B- and one C+ player who come off the bench with B+ players...but how much better would that make me? Would there be complaints that my B+ waiver wire pickup has C or C- control?
If it was me ticking you off that much, you should have contacted me. But I am clearly not the only one playing bad players. Other teams played much, much worse...but I don't know how you even have time to look at everyone's lineups with all the leagues you're in. I can barely keep up with one at a time!
I think no matter what league you play in you are going to run into this. That makes me surprised you play the game if me playing 2 players this season made up your mind and sent you over the top to the point you need to leave the league.
BTW - 31 wins. Definitely NOT the worst in league history.
[Edited on 3-10-2015 by ryang]
March 10, 2015 at 12:54PM View BBCode
I played two questionable players this season, and because of the fuss I ended up limiting their time.I've been asking for people's suggestions. Do I trade my first rounders to get better players and finish near .400? Or do I play all B+ players from the waiver wire and don't play my 23 year olds? Or do I bring up someone from my minors at OS21? I can replace one B- and one C+ player who come off the bench with B+ players...but how much better would that make me? Would there be complaints that my B+ waiver wire pickup has C or C- control?
If it was me ticking you off that much, you should have contacted me. But I am clearly not the only one playing bad players. Other teams played much, much worse...but I don't know how you even have time to look at everyone's lineups with all the leagues you're in. I can barely keep up with one at a time!
I think no matter what league you play in you are going to run into this. That makes me surprised you play the game if me playing 2 players this season made up your mind and sent you over the top to the point you need to leave the league.
BTW - 31 wins. Definitely NOT the worst in league history.
[Edited on 3-10-2015 by ryang]
dtv
I'd say you could significantly upgrade your team by cutting all "c" control pitchers and Hrabosky and replacing them with better pitchers on the waiver wire. There were a lot of pitchers on the waiver wire this season who could post respectable numbers. Upgrading all the "c" control pitchers wouldn't cost anything and won't turn you into a contender, but it would move the loss total closer to 100.
There's also a number of "respectably" bad hitters on the waiver wire. There's really no reason to start a SS with D+ range and D+ power.
In my experience, you can usually limit the losses to around 110 even in the most desperate rebuilds just by using decent waiver wire guys for the positions you don't have prospects ready. Luck and the depth available on the waiver wire will always play a part, but there's decent talent freely available in this league.
[Edited on 3-10-2015 by dtv]
March 10, 2015 at 01:47PM View BBCode
My two cents, for what it's worth:I'd say you could significantly upgrade your team by cutting all "c" control pitchers and Hrabosky and replacing them with better pitchers on the waiver wire. There were a lot of pitchers on the waiver wire this season who could post respectable numbers. Upgrading all the "c" control pitchers wouldn't cost anything and won't turn you into a contender, but it would move the loss total closer to 100.
There's also a number of "respectably" bad hitters on the waiver wire. There's really no reason to start a SS with D+ range and D+ power.
In my experience, you can usually limit the losses to around 110 even in the most desperate rebuilds just by using decent waiver wire guys for the positions you don't have prospects ready. Luck and the depth available on the waiver wire will always play a part, but there's decent talent freely available in this league.
[Edited on 3-10-2015 by dtv]
ryang
Or maybe I'll disappear 6 days at a time and not fix my lineups? LOL!
[Edited on 3-10-2015 by ryang]
March 10, 2015 at 03:31PM View BBCode
So when I make these moves, and end up with 30 wins next year, nobody will complain? Don't wanna hear it next season when I pick up these B+/B pitchers and A/C hitters.Or maybe I'll disappear 6 days at a time and not fix my lineups? LOL!
[Edited on 3-10-2015 by ryang]
nuzzy62
If you are trying to develop your young guys, you will play them over vets, because they won't get better riding pine.
It's to the degree of some not trying to win, that has people bothered.
---
The flip side of using extremely crappy players is that the four foreign players we get in the draft pool are based on the major league average, so if we have a bunch of people tanking to the extreme, it makes these players worse. Buzzz and I have had this conversation as to why the foreign talent here so much worse than in other leagues. Then it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy, these lesser foreign players add to the dilution.
March 10, 2015 at 04:01PM View BBCode
Everyone tries not to put out the best team possible at some point.If you are trying to develop your young guys, you will play them over vets, because they won't get better riding pine.
It's to the degree of some not trying to win, that has people bothered.
---
The flip side of using extremely crappy players is that the four foreign players we get in the draft pool are based on the major league average, so if we have a bunch of people tanking to the extreme, it makes these players worse. Buzzz and I have had this conversation as to why the foreign talent here so much worse than in other leagues. Then it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy, these lesser foreign players add to the dilution.
dtv
For example, a guy like Tommy Wiggs who sat on the waiver wire pretty much all year will give you respectable number with decent defense behind him. If you get B+ pitchers with B+ control you should be able to shave a couple runs off the 7. whatever ERA you had this season.
Obviously, you won't contend or even see .500, but it'd be impossible in my book to accuse you of tanking. Good luck with the rebuild.
March 10, 2015 at 04:09PM View BBCode
Well, I would get the higher control guys. I don't think I'm letting the cat out of the bag when I say control is more important than velocity and power is more important than contact. Flip the two around with adequate defense and I'd be surprised if you don't get closer to 50 wins.For example, a guy like Tommy Wiggs who sat on the waiver wire pretty much all year will give you respectable number with decent defense behind him. If you get B+ pitchers with B+ control you should be able to shave a couple runs off the 7. whatever ERA you had this season.
Obviously, you won't contend or even see .500, but it'd be impossible in my book to accuse you of tanking. Good luck with the rebuild.
Buzzz
Don, I'd be in favor, any proposals ?
- TWL-like loss penalty system
- draft lotto
- ?
What are other suggestions? Then we can weed-er down to a possible vote
March 10, 2015 at 11:58PM View BBCode
Originally posted by don4593
Would anyone be in favor of a lottery type system? I can figure out the details and present some options. I feel like this is in between the most harsh tanking rule and what we have in place now
Don, I'd be in favor, any proposals ?
- TWL-like loss penalty system
- draft lotto
- ?
What are other suggestions? Then we can weed-er down to a possible vote
ahmlton
March 11, 2015 at 12:11AM View BBCode
He is getting top pick regardless of what you put in. Live with it. Some people, like me, crave the top pick. And guess what, we get burned. See lerch. The league is just fine. Pay more attention to non active teams. They hurt the league.
Buzzz
On second thought Don don't bother it ain't going happen. Will just have to live with it.
March 11, 2015 at 12:35AM View BBCode
Originally posted by Buzzz
Originally posted by don4593
Would anyone be in favor of a lottery type system? I can figure out the details and present some options. I feel like this is in between the most harsh tanking rule and what we have in place now
Don, I'd be in favor, any proposals ?
- TWL-like loss penalty system
- draft lotto
- ?
What are other suggestions? Then we can weed-er down to a possible vote
On second thought Don don't bother it ain't going happen. Will just have to live with it.
ryang
March 12, 2015 at 03:21AM View BBCode
The best backup catcher on the wire is B- overall. The best SS on the wire that is a mentor is B overall. I don't wanna hear it...I can already hear the moans as I play my OS 24 players...Pages: 1 2